A fresh start with DSR

[TonyK]

Hi everyone and Glenn.

I am from Perth, Australia and will be the first one to implement the DSR system here : O

I have some questions, naturally and am glad this forum exists.

I currently run the full ZeoVit system (for 6 months) and although the results have been good, I am getting really tired of manually dosing many additives, water changes and the very high cost of having to use many Zeo products here in Australia!

My questions are:
I don't want to shock my system with a rise in nutrients, can anyone recommend a protocol/way for "going off" the Zeo system, particularly with the carbon source (Start 3) and the Zeolites, slowly?

My tank parameters match those recommended for the Zeo system currently (and most other systems), are there other "ideal" values that need to be implemented (to be used in the calculator), such as higher alk or calcium levels or should I stay with the levels that currently work for my tank?

Thanks,
Tony

 

[bvds]

Hi everyone and Glenn.

I am from Perth, Australia and will be the first one to implement the DSR system here : O

I have some questions, naturally and am glad this forum exists.

I currently run the full ZeoVit system (for 6 months) and although the results have been good, I am getting really tired of manually dosing many additives, water changes and the very high cost of having to use many Zeo products here in Australia!

My questions are:
I don't want to shock my system with a rise in nutrients, can anyone recommend a protocol/way for "going off" the Zeo system, particularly with the carbon source (Start 3) and the Zeolites, slowly?

My tank parameters match those recommended for the Zeo system currently (and most other systems), are there other "ideal" values that need to be implemented (to be used in the calculator), such as higher alk or calcium levels or should I stay with the levels that currently work for my tank?

Thanks,
Tony

Hi Tony,

Welcome to this forum:biggrin:

I think GlennF will be the man to answer your questions most accurately, but i will try to give some answers.
First i don't think there are many DSR users who switched from Zeo to the DSR method. So for this one i think you should try to contact GlennF.(ps. an overview of your current tank parameters would be helpful)

Second, the "ideal" DSR parameters are located in the DSR calculator(i don't know if you downloaded it yet?). But be aware those are just recommended values for an "mixed" reef. I personally try to run my PO4 and No3 a bit lower than the recommended values because i'm going for a SPS dominated reef. In other words you can adapt to the recommended water parameters but it is also possible to keep running your already successful parameters but using the DSR method to do so.

Did you came acros: http://dsrreefing.nl ? there you can find some info which is also in english.

ps. I hope my english is understandable, i'm not used to type in a foreign language

 

[Coppa]

Hi Tony,

first of all, great to see you on our forum , here in "little" Belgium
I, also am looking for a way to reduce measuring and H2O changes... but I thought that with the DSR methode you have still have to mearure and change.... so not ideal for me.
There are way's to automatic add additives... why not try that?

ps; Perth.. great city. I remember the time We were in Australië, sitting under a tree and above in the tree lots of parrots... amazing !

Also Esperance was worth while a visit ... we were there around Christmas

kr,
Kris

 

[A3LXK]

Measure that's only once a week and there are no water changes with the DSR methode.
And you don't have to measure all the parameters every week.

Hi Tony,

first of all, great to see you on our forum , here in "little" Belgium
I, also am looking for a way to reduce measuring and H2O changes... but I thought that with the DSR methode you have still have to mearure and change.... so not ideal for me.
There are way's to automatic add additives... why not try that?

ps; Perth.. great city. I remember the time We were in Australië, sitting under a tree and above in the tree lots of parrots... amazing !

Also Esperance was worth while a visit ... we were there around Christmas

kr,
Kris

 

[Ray48]

Welcome Tony,

I think it's best to ask that question to GlennF.
In my opinion the best thing to do is just starting, do your tests and get it to the 0-level according to the calculator. Then after 4 days another testing and you know your daily needs.

I can also recomment you to start a diary so ppl can see what you do and if you have problems other ppl can read it and learn from it as well.

The place to make that is right here: http://zeewaterforum.info/forums/forumdisplay.php?44-Aquarium-Dagboeken

 

[TonyK]

Welcome Tony,I think it's best to ask that question to GlennF.In my opinion the best thing to do is just starting, do your tests and get it to the 0-level according to the calculator. Then after 4 days another testing and you know your daily needs.I can also recomment you to start a diary so ppl can see what you do and if you have problems other ppl can read it and learn from it as well.The place to make that is right here: http://zeewaterforum.info/forums/forumdisplay.php?44-Aquarium-Dagboeken

Thanks Ray48I will try to start a diary, depends on my schedule, but I will try

Measure that's only once a week and there are no water changes with the DSR methode.And you don't have to measure all the parameters every week.

Thanks A3LXKI will remember that, similar to how I test now.

Hi Tony, first of all, great to see you on our forum , here in "little" Belgium I, also am looking for a way to reduce measuring and H2O changes... but I thought that with the DSR methode you have still have to mearure and change.... so not ideal for me.There are way's to automatic add additives... why not try that? ps; Perth.. great city. I remember the time We were in Australië, sitting under a tree and above in the tree lots of parrots... amazing !Also Esperance was worth while a visit ... we were there around Christmas kr,Kris

Hi KrisI wanted to get away from the water changes as the "cure" to any problems with Zeo was always water changes!I also want exact control of what chemicals I mix into my RODI water and i am getting tired of all the little blue bottles that not even the gurus know the constitution of.I also have multiple dosing pumps so automation should not be a problem.I am glad that you got a chance to visit this part of our beautiful world and yes Esperance with its sparkling white beaches is lovely. I hope it was not too hot for you :biggrin:

Hi Tony,Welcome to this forum:biggrin:I think GlennF will be the man to answer your questions most accurately, but i will try to give some answers.First i don't think there are many DSR users who switched from Zeo to the DSR method. So for this one i think you should try to contact GlennF.(ps. an overview of your current tank parameters would be helpful)Second, the "ideal" DSR parameters are located in the DSR calculator(i don't know if you downloaded it yet?). But be aware those are just recommended values for an "mixed" reef. I personally try to run my PO4 and No3 a bit lower than the recommended values because i'm going for a SPS dominated reef. In other words you can adapt to the recommended water parameters but it is also possible to keep running your already successful parameters but using the DSR method to do so. Did you came acros: http://dsrreefing.nl ? there you can find some info which is also in english.ps. I hope my english is understandable, i'm not used to type in a foreign language

Hi bvdsIt's a pleasure to be here and your English is perfect The Zeo forum suggests a gradual reduction in zeolites and carbon over several weeks.My tank is mixed but with 70% sps dominant and my PO4 and NO3 values are currently undetectable and yes I also keep some parameters a bit lower.I have looked at the website and find it helpful and of course I have studied the calculator and will be making some water soon to test it Here are some details of my systemTank: 1200x60x60 (eurobraced low-iron glass on 3 sides)Sump: 90x40x40 with Skimz 201 skimmer and Kamoer dosing pumps, 2L zeolite reactor, return and reactor pumps are Sicce.Net water volume ~500LWater movement: Vortec MP40 Jebao RW-15 Sicce voyager 4 (X2)Lights: 2x Radion Pro Gen2Currently running full Zeovit systemParameters: kH-7.5 Ca~400 Mg~1300 K+~390 1.025 SG No3-undetectable PO4-undetectable on Hanna pH-8.1-8.2I don't test for other parameters yet.I hope this helps.Thank you everyone, cheers,Tony

 

[Youri.]

Hi Tony!

First of all welcome on our forum! :biggrin:
Great to hear you will be using the DSR-method and you are a 'pioneer' down under!

I am currently using the DSR-method. Before I switched to this method I was also using the Zeovit method.
I used Zeofood, Zeobak, Zeospur, Zeostart and I also used a Zeolit filter and a zeovit active carbon.

I slowly reduced the daily dosing of the Zeovit additives and removed the active carbon. Then I just started using the DSR method. Because my No3 and Po4 were very low during the Zeovit time I was not worried to wait a couple of days before using the DSR Carbon (just to make sure I was not overdosing, however looking back, I don't think this would have become a problem). You can just measure al the other DSR additions before dosing them and at first you will have to measure on a reggular basis to determ the comsumption. The DSR-method and calculator really enables you to control your parameters, so even if a parameter will deviate due to the change of method, you will have the means to correct them (and that is the power of the DSR-method I believe).
The Zeolit filter and Zeolites are still running. I believe they are hellpfull since I don't have that much live rock (only some Reef Bones) to get some more bacteria in the watercolumn. I just occasionally shake the filter and I haven't replaced the Zeolites sinds I stopped using Zeovit and that was about a year a go.
I would advise you to keep your Po4 measureable on your Hanna Checker. I use the Hanna Checker aswell and when I measure 0,00 with it I really see that the corals aren't happy. Even the Acropora's need some Po4. I try to keep my P04 at 0,05 with the lower margin 0,02 and the upper margin 0,08.

Looking forward to hear your experiences with the DSR-method and I am curious how your tank looks like!
Will you be starting a journal of your tank on this forum? I think that would be very interesting! If so you can start a new topic at 'Aquarium Dagboeken'.

Best regards,

Youri

 

[robbor]

Welkom

 

[TonyK]

Hi Tony!

First of all welcome on our forum! :biggrin:
Great to hear you will be using the DSR-method and you are a 'pioneer' down under!

I am currently using the DSR-method. Before I switched to this method I was also using the Zeovit method.
I used Zeofood, Zeobak, Zeospur, Zeostart and I also used a Zeolit filter and a zeovit active carbon.

I slowly reduced the daily dosing of the Zeovit additives and removed the active carbon. Then I just started using the DSR method. Because my No3 and Po4 were very low during the Zeovit time I was not worried to wait a couple of days before using the DSR Carbon (just to make sure I was not overdosing, however looking back, I don't think this would have become a problem). You can just measure al the other DSR additions before dosing them and at first you will have to measure on a reggular basis to determ the comsumption. The DSR-method and calculator really enables you to control your parameters, so even if a parameter will deviate due to the change of method, you will have the means to correct them (and that is the power of the DSR-method I believe).
The Zeolit filter and Zeolites are still running. I believe they are hellpfull since I don't have that much live rock (only some Reef Bones) to get some more bacteria in the watercolumn. I just occasionally shake the filter and I haven't replaced the Zeolites sinds I stopped using Zeovit and that was about a year a go.
I would advise you to keep your Po4 measureable on your Hanna Checker. I use the Hanna Checker aswell and when I measure 0,00 with it I really see that the corals aren't happy. Even the Acropora's need some Po4. I try to keep my P04 at 0,05 with the lower margin 0,02 and the upper margin 0,08.

Looking forward to hear your experiences with the DSR-method and I am curious how your tank looks like!
Will you be starting a journal of your tank on this forum? I think that would be very interesting! If so you can start a new topic at 'Aquarium Dagboeken'.

Best regards,

Youri

Hi Youri

Thank you for those kind words.

It has taken a long (6 months) to get my nutrients down, with the tank only running for a total of 8 months.

I only started adding sps after 4 months of running the system but then two months ago we had to move house and my sps all suffered (it is winter here and my heaters could not control the temperature during the move so the temperature went down, for two days), this caused some bleaching but mostly a browning out of the colours. I did not see a rise in nutrients after the move, actually the opposite.

They have subsequently started to colour up again, but slowly, now that the parameters are stable once again.

It is precisely the control in the DSR method that I like.

I was thinking on similar lines to you about the zeolites, as they would function the same as live rock, just with a greater surface area, once exhausted and I may leave them in the reactor too.

I did not really want the pale look of the corals as I think they are starved excessively, I just want healthy, growing corals.

I will post some pictures once I get back to the office (it is past bed-time here )

I will try to start a 'dagboek' :biggrin:
Cheers,
Tony

 

[GlennF]

Welcome tony,
Very pleased you joined us on the dutch forum.
As stated before, you are the first to use DSR in that region of the world.
I will be following your progess closely. You have great corals out there.

It is possible to navigate the nutrient levels at any level you feel it's working best for you live stock at any given moment. You have the tools for it.

Youri is the one, who has best experience migrating from ZEO to DSR. So you should follow his advise.
His tank made very good progress since the migration.
All other questions are welcome and we will try to help you find your way.

Before you start you should take pictures and do measurement to see where you stand.
From that point on you are ready to go and follow the advice given by the calculator.
If anything not clear, do ask and we will try to help you out.
I say we, because dsr users are happy to help each other out and share the their gathered knowledge freely.

greetings, GlennF

 

[TonyK]

Welcome tony,
Very pleased you joined us on the dutch forum.
As stated before, you are the first to use DSR in that region of the world.
I will be following your progess closely. You have great corals out there.

It is possible to navigate the nutrient levels at any level you feel it's working best for you live stock at any given moment. You have the tools for it.

Youri is the one, who has best experience migrating from ZEO to DSR. So you should follow his advise.
His tank made very good progress since the migration.
All other questions are welcome and we will try to help you find your way.

Before you start you should take pictures and do measurement to see where you stand.
From that point on you are ready to go and follow the advice given by the calculator.
If anything not clear, do ask and we will try to help you out.
I say we, because dsr users are happy to help each other out and share the their gathered knowledge freely.

greetings, GlennF

Hi Glenn

Glad to be here.

I have all the "ingredients" at home waiting :biggrin:

I will first mix up a small (15%) volume of water and do a change and see if the corals react in any way (I am looking for positive signs i.e. PE, maybe even colour differences) to the 'optimal' parameters I calculated using your spreadsheet.

Then next week I will stop with the water changes after testing all the parameters and go from there, documenting all the way!

I will ask many questions
Cheers,
Tony

 

[A3LXK]

Hi Tony,

it's no problem if you gonna ask a lot of questions, most of the DSR users will answer them for you.
That's all what DSR is about, to help each other every which way we can, and if we can't answer, Glenn will answer them

I could say look at me diary (dagboek) but there is nothing to read for you there cause it's all in Dutch.

From now on i will write Dutch and English language in my diary, so foreign people could read and understand it too.

Good luck with your journey, prepare yourself for a new experience, you will see the result within a couple of weeks.

Greetings,
Adri

p.s. We already spoke on facebook, i directed you to the dsrreefing.nl website.

 

[TonyK]

Hi Tony,

it's no problem if you gonna ask a lot of questions, most of the DSR users will answer them for you.
That's all what DSR is about, to help each other every which way we can, and if we can't answer, Glenn will answer them

I could say look at me diary (dagboek) but there is nothing to read for you there cause it's all in Dutch.

From now on i will write Dutch and English language in my diary, so foreign people could read and understand it too.

Good luck with your journey, prepare yourself for a new experience, you will see the result within a couple of weeks.

Greetings,
Adri

p.s. We already spoke on facebook, i directed you to the dsrreefing.nl website.

Hi Adri

Good to know you are on here too :biggrin:

Being a scientist, I will read everything and B.T.W. Google translator=AWESOME

I hope to get good results!!

Cheers,
Tony

 

[TonyK]

Hi everyone

I started a tank diary thread called restart downunder.

Cheers,
Tony

 

[robbor]

I gonna follow your diary